Eric Gordon or Tyreke Evans?

[CameronCrazy06]

If I'm getting support from Bosox and Rip, you know I have to be right haha.

 

[jonathanlambert33]

Comparing Dwyane Wade to Tyreke Evans is probably a sign that you've had one too many Christmas cocktails today, so I'll ignore that all together. Let's take a look at Sports Illustrated's list of the top 10 SG's in the NBA:
 
Outside of Wade, and Iguodala (who is really a SF and is actually still a 33.2% three point shooter in his career), who on that list is not a good three-point shooter? There's reasons why Tyreke Evans is not on this list and that is one of the biggest ones. But let's talk about why I wouldn't want a non-shooter on my team starting at SG, unless it was the HOF-bound Dwyane Wade:
 
Simply put, the midrange jumper has become a lost art in basketball. Since you like to make fancy tables to act proper about these debates, and my relatives aren't coming over until much later, I'll make one too. This is based on Shot Data from hoopdata.com from the 12-13 season.

Here's the explanation. The blue bar is the field goal percentage of every type of shot in basketball. The red bar is the points per shot based on these percentages. As you can see, the ONLY shot types that have a PPS above 1 are the shots at the rim and three pointers. Therefore, if I am a basketball coach, I would want to gear my offense to mainly get those two shots. You see this more prominent in college basketball (especially with Giant Killer teams like Davidson, Belmont, etc.), but it's also a theory used by many coaches in the pros. Mike Krzyzewski (not a pro coach, I know) isn't the one who started this theory, but it's pretty prominent with Duke Basketball. The only players who really shoot mid-range shots ever on our team are Jabari Parker and Rodney Hood, two players who will be first round draft picks next year and can basically get whatever type of shot they want at any time.
 
So now let's bring this back to Reke. Obviously, Reke is good at getting to the rim. But let's take a look at how his shooting statistics from all the spots in the graph above compare to the league average (this is again data from last season):
 
As you can see, Evans is below the league average at EVERY spot! That's remarkable. I'll call at the rim a wash because they're very close. His 10-15 feet percentage was his best since his rookie year (43.2%), but in the two years in between that he shot 25.0% and 23.2% respectively, so in averaging these four years together, it's fair to say he's below average at this spot. Now three-pointers: also pretty close to the league average, but could easily be called an outlier, especially considering his percentages this year. No question he's below average here.
 
So now, why would you want a SHOOTING GUARD on your team that is below average at every spot on the court outside of the rim? Seems to me there are plenty of shooting guards who can score the ball more effectively that that. Here's just a few of them (all SG's in the league who played 30+ MPG last year):
 
Throw in Jamal Crawford (29.4 MPG), Gordon Hayward (29.3 MPG), Dion Waiters (28.8 MPG), and maybe a few others and that's probably an accurate list of SG's I'd take over Tyreke Evans.

Let me start by saying I'm not sure where you were trying to go with certain parts of this post. You and every other person that knows anything about the game of basketball would try to gear their offense around the rim and behind the 3pt line. I guess that's just you saying where everyone would want to get their shots from, nobody wants to take a heavy amount of shots inside the dead zone. In Rekes case, if he was on the floor with four other players that also had no outside game, then his lack of an outside shot would matter. It would obviously mean that offense is going to be really poor, but that is not the case here.

It's about the five guys you put on the court, and how those five play together. It's never about one individual player. The guys Reke shares the floor with on the Pels, they all really complement his skill set. We've seen countless teams put together lineups that look great on paper, but they just don't mesh well on the court. If the Pels were playing a lineup of Rivers, Evans, Aminu, Davis, and Smith then you would have a point. But our most used lineup going forward is Holiday, Gordon, Evans, Anderson, and Davis. That lineup is filled with players that are perfect compliments next to Reke. Floor spacers, ball movers, rim runners, guys that don't turn the ball over that much, and so on. He may not have a outside shot, but he still scores the ball efficiently and effectively without it, and his lack of a shot hurts the team in no way when he is on the court. The team is at its best when he is on the court, that is what matters. For all the graphs and stuff you just laid out, you didn't really state where in the grand scheme of things it hurts him. He still scores a lot of points and does it efficiently, or effectively as you said. More efficiently and effectively than a lot of the guys on that list you posted.

The Pelicans are at their best when Jrue and Tyreke are on the court, great perimeter game or a lack of a perimeter game, those two outscore the opponent by 12 pts when they're on the court, the teams fg% and 3pt% each climb by 5% when those two are on the court together. 34% of the possessions end in FT's. On the other end, the opponents free throws decrease and their turnovers increase. They fit the system and make their teammates better, and as a result the team is better.

The graphs about his perimeter game look nice, but what the five man lineup does is what matters, not whether or not he has a midrange or perimeter game, which we've known for years that he does not. The graphs just tell us what we have known for a while. Next time you should focus on how he impacts the game (positively or negatively).

As for the rest of your post, I'm not comparing Tyreke to DWade. No clue where you got that idea from, unless just mentioning two players in the same sentence means you're comparing them, but that would be news to me. And the SG's you would take over Reke? Afflalo? Henderson? Redick? Smith? Mayo? Matthews? Jamal Crawford?!?! You can have those guys, I'll take the better player.

 

[CameronCrazy06]

I think you're in the minority on a lot of those decisions at the bottom, so I won't even bother getting into that.
 
Clearly you have an inflated opinion of Evans ever since he signed with the Hornets/Pelicans. I'm pretty sure if he were playing for any other team, you wouldn't like him that much. The question was "in a fantasy world, which player would you take", not "does he fit well with the Pelicans" (which despite how much you hype this "great" lineup, the Pelicans still aren't even that good of a team!)
 
I lol'ed at you saying someone who is shooting 41% from the field scores efficiently though.

 

[bosoxlover12]

All those guys except Gerald Henderson are definitely better than Reke, and Henderson is about equal

 

[jonathanlambert33]

I think you're in the minority on a lot of those decisions at the bottom, so I won't even bother getting into that.
 
Clearly you have an inflated opinion of Evans ever since he signed with the Hornets/Pelicans. I'm pretty sure if he were playing for any other team, you wouldn't like him that much. The question was "in a fantasy world, which player would you take", not "does he fit well with the Pelicans" (which despite how much you hype this "great" lineup, the Pelicans still aren't even that good of a team!)
 
I lol'ed at you saying someone who is shooting 41% from the field scores efficiently though.

Dec 12, 2012:

He hasn't blown up into the player people thought he would be after his rookie year, but the guy is still a really good player. The Kings would be stupid to let one of their few bright spots get away.

I've always thought of Tyreke as a really good player, him being a Pelican has nothing to do with it. The 41% from the field, I've outlined why that is deceptive. Over the last month and a half, he has shot 45% from the field, along with 1.3 points per shot. That's since he came back from the ankle and admitted to being out of game shape. I know you'll probably say that you can't take away those other games, but whatever. We've seen enough of Tyreke to know that he's efficient scoring the basketball.

As for that list. Iggy, Wade, Harden, Kobe, Hayward are better. Beal will be better, Waiters too I suppose if he ever gets his head out of his ass, DeRozan is a wash. Wesley Matthews is playing better right now, but he won't keep this pace up. You can throw JR in that initial list depending on what his mental state is. I don't know how many times I've said this, but you can't completely throw away one side of the ball. That's why guys like Thompson aren't ahead of him, you guys love your offensive players and shooters but Thompson plays zero defense.
 

The question was "in a fantasy world, which player would you take", not "does he fit well with the Pelicans"

I'll agree with this. And I hype that lineup because they play excellent basketball together. Problem being, it involves playing Davis extended minutes at C which they aren't ready to do yet. The team itself, obviously still has some holes to fill.

 

[jonathanlambert33]

All those guys except Gerald Henderson are definitely better than Reke, and Henderson is about equal

lol, I'm really interested in hearing your reasoning behind this.