NFCS QB's vs NFCE QB's

[cruzg24]

hmmm....

1. Brees
2. Vick
3. Ryan
4. Manning
5. Romo
6. Freeman
7. Mcnabb
8. Newton

 

[VC15]

Even with Newton being a rookie.. Freeman, Brees, Ryan > Every QB in the NFC North.

Romo is good, but not AS good as the few listed above.

You overrate Manning bad, really bad actually.

John Beck IS MAKING MOVES DAMMIT.

Mike Vick is the best QB in the NFC East. But Brees >

Freeman and Ryan are better than Rodgers?

By the way, Eli is underrated here, if anything.

 

[kam.]

Freeman and Ryan are better than Rodgers?

By the way, Eli is underrated here, if anything.

I meant NFC East, get East and North mixed up sometimes.

Manning isn't a top 10 QB. Probably not even Top 15.

Brees
Vick
Ryan
Freeman
Romo
Manning
Mcnabb
Newton

 

[VC15]

Freeman and Ryan each had great seasons this year, but were very pedestrian before that.

One year, a career does not make.

For Manning, here's a good (albeit long) read:

Eli benefits from a strong running game and defense

Simple answer to this is: no. Our defense has been consistently below average in points allowed. Last year we were 17th and the year before that 30th. We were constantly playing from behind and it was Eli that kept us in most of the games.
The running game was ranked 17th a couple years ago, and even though we were ranked 6th this year, almost all of our fumbles came off of our running game. They definitely helped, but were also a terrible liability as well.

Eli is nothing but a turnover-prone game manager with a mediocre skillset

You can look at the career stats of Eli, and they’ll be average at best. But that’s because he was horrible in 2005 and 2006, and half of 2007. I’ll freely admit to that. But his stats are skewed because of it. Even Peyton went 1-15 his first year.

If you want to compare Eli, he started to finally mature and become the QB he is now during the 2007 playoffs. The reason why that is mentioned so much is because his play has significantly elevated from then on. It was his renaissance period so to speak.

In the 2007 period, he had 23 TDs and 20 INTs, which is basically a 1:1 ratio: not good at all. He turned it on during the playoffs, with 6 TDs and 1 INT. He showcased incredible leadership in all the games. Giants had 0 points in the first half of the TB game. Eli got the team going and they ended up dominating the second half. Versus the Cowboys, Eli engineered a TD drive in the final 00:45 seconds of the half which was the spark plug for the team win. With the championship game, he showed incredible leadership again, leading the Giants down for several game winning chances that Lawrence Tynes missed. He finally made the kick after 3 unsuccessful tries. And the superbowl, well, chalk it up to luck or whatever the hell you want, fact remains that Eli drove down for THE game winning drive. The defense was strong, absolutely agree with you there, but they consistently gave up the lead as well. It was Eli that took time off the clock and only left Brady with less than a minute. Also, your opinion is your opinion, but fact remains that he was the Superbowl MVP, and there’s a reason for it.

In any case, after the 2007 season, Eli had a season where he went 21 TDs, and 10 INTs, a ratio of 2:1, obviously, a massive improvement. Then in 2009, when the defense and running game shat the bed, Eli went off for 4000+ yards, 27 TDs and 14 INTs. In many cases, he literally was responsible for at least 6 of the Giants’ 8 wins.
On top of this, he played most of the year with plantar fasciitiis. Take it from a med student when I tell you how ridiculously painful that is. Still, his TD to INT ratio was at 2:1 as well. The defense collapsed, that’s not on him.

This past year, he threw a lot of INTs, yes, but I explained the reasoning for it in the other thread. He lost his top two WRs, and had to pick up WRs off the street. That in itself is extremely difficult because the most underrated and crucial aspect of quarterbacking is chemistry with the WR.

The concept of him being a "game manager" is also ridiculous. Gunslinger is probably more appropriate. Everybody shits on him for his INTs this season, but another important stat is conspicuously absent in their arguments. He was 4th highest in TD passes. Only Drew Brees and Peyton Manning had 2 more than him. And Tom Brady led all with only 5 more than Eli.

Also, another reason that people don’t consider is the fact that he plays in Giants stadium. The swirling winds there are notorious for fucking with a QB. Tony Romo has better efficiency stats than Eli, but I’d like to see him play half his games at the Meadowlands rather than nice, comfy Cowboys Stadium.

Eli’s efficiency and passer ratings have been rising each season. With each season, his completion percentage has increased. He was at 63% last season, good enough for 9th in the league and he was 5th in passing yards. Besides the interceptions, every part of his game got better, and I already explained the interceptions. On top of that, of course you’ve heard the WR tipping balls argument as well, so I’m not getting into that.

Eli is not a leader, isn’t a winner and has no personality

Almost every one of his teammates has come out and said that Eli unquestionably is their leader. They’ve come out and said that he spends an unbelievable amount of time in the film room and has a ridiculous work ethic.

Eli is one of the best audiblers in the game, and that’s been asserted by NYTimes (can’t find the link right now). I’ve said, ad nauseum, that he has more comebacks and game winning drives than Tony Romo. Some of the comebacks that he’s had have been simply awe-inspiring (no, there’s no stat for that, that’s just the homer in me talking).

As far as his personality and whatever, alot of you reference the infamous "Manning face," which yes, looks slightly retarded, but to say that is measure of his personality is ridiculous. When that bastard Tiki Barber made comments questioning Eli Manning, Eli turned right around and ripped him a new one. When Tiki interviewed Eli during the Superbowl win, Eli turned around and said, "Well, all I’m going to say is we had the right 50 guys on the field today." Right, Eli has no personality. Eli’s intelligence is also highly underrated; he scored a 38 on the Wonderlic (cue responses of "the Wonderlic is worthless" right about now).

Another testament to his character is his durability and toughness. I already mentioned that he played through the entire year with plantar fasciitis. He also played a couple weeks with a separated shoulder. That takes ginormous balls, nobody can deny that. He is 2nd in the active QB list for most consecutive starts behind only Peyton. You can downplay that stat all you want, but its important to be a model of consistency in that regard. It provides reassurance to the rest of your team that you’ll be there, doing everything in your power to be your best, and the power of that cannot be underestimated.

Eli is also known for his temper. Or rather, lack of it. What people mistake for indifference is the level-headedness required to play in New York. For most of his career, Eli was ripped by the media and by his own fans (myself included; I admit it). People were calling for his head right up until the 2007 playoffs. How did Eli respond? He shrugged it off. He is a consummate professional in every sense of the word. He takes your criticism and gives you the finger by not responding to it and leading the Giants to victory. You can talk about his mediocre win percentage or what not. But the fact remains (and I’m going to continue to beat this drum because it’s THAT important.) that in all the years he’s played quarterback, he’s NEVER had a losing season. Not once, regardless of how his defense played.

Also, he’s led the Giants to the playoffs in all but two years of his career. We talked about 2009, where he carried the team to 8 wins, but his defense let him down. Last year, he still led the Giants to 10 wins (technically, should have been 11 since he cannot be blamed for the nightmare at the Meadowlands, since he put up 30+ points, had 4 TDs and 1 INT, and a 105.6 QB rating in that game). Normally, 10 wins usually = playoffs.

Manning is the best fit for the NY Giants. He’s the consummate professional, his work ethic is tremendous (and it shows by his consistent improvement from year to year), he led us to a Superbowl, he hasn’t complained once despite all the shit he’s taken, is a great guy off the field, the past two years his stats have been top 10 worthy despite playing in a QB unfriendly environment like the Meadowlands, and he’s proven that he can carry the team on his back, and no one can question his toughness.
It’s these reasons that give me the utmost faith in Eli as a top 10 quarterback in the league.

Now please, go ahead and poke holes in this argument if you want. People throw around a bunch of cherry picked stats about how Eli is a mediocre at best QB. I’ll be happy that he’s the leader of my favorite team, and leave it at that.

 

[kam.]

Freeman and Ryan each had great seasons this year, but were very pedestrian before that.

One year, a career does not make.

Um, Freeman was a rookie the year before.

Ryan had 2 good years, the year before last was Meh, but he was injured throughout the year. Id take both Freeman and Ryan over Manning.

 

[VC15]

Um, Freeman was a rookie the year before.

Ryan had 2 good years, the year before last was Meh, but he was injured throughout the year. Id take both Freeman and Ryan over Manning.

If you bothered to read my Manning post, you'd know that Eli posted a 2:1 TD/INT ratio while battling plantar fasciltis for nearly the entire 2009 season. The injury argument will not hold much water here.

Freeman? Let's see if he can sustain that success before we crown him.

 

[kam.]

If you bothered to read my Manning post, you'd know that Eli posted a 2:1 TD/INT ratio while battling plantar fasciltis for nearly the entire 2009 season. The injury argument will not hold much water here.

Freeman? Let's see if he can sustain that success before we crown him.

LOL. iM NOT USING IT AS A ARGUMENT.

Ryan MISSED games due to injury.

Im not saying he didnt play well because of injury.

 

[VC15]

LOL. iM NOT USING IT AS A ARGUMENT.

Ryan MISSED games due to injury.

Im not saying he didnt play well because of injury.

As Robert Freeman would say:

Tough titty for him.

His body of work (same goes for Freeman) is nowhere near as impressive as Eli's.

 

[WHO-DEY-BENGALS_18]

My list, personally....

Brees
Romo
Vick
Ryan
Freeman
Manning
McNabb
Newton

Yes... I know.. I'm a bit high on Tony Romo.. lol

 

[VC15]

My list, personally....

Brees
Romo
Vick
Ryan
Freeman
Manning
McNabb
Newton

Yes... I know.. I'm a bit high on meth.. lol

Fixed.

 

[kam.]

As Robert Freeman would say:

Tough titty for him.

His body of work (same goes for Freeman) is nowhere near as impressive as Eli's.

NFL is a "what have you done for me lately" league.

If people were ranked on their body of work. LT would be the NFLs Best RB.

 

[WHO-DEY-BENGALS_18]

Fixed.

Well, I knew you wouldn't agree. If your guys aren't #1 on everything whether it's NFL, MLB or whatever else... They are wrong. They are instantly idiots.