Carmelo Wants Out; Denver Working on it

[dez]

12-70

 

[VC15]

12-70

Care to remind me where two of those wins came from?

Could you remind me on how the Knicks last playoff series went?

Article of truth

 

[dez]

Your so hyped bout those 2 wins vs us yet always talk about how mediocre we are i dont get it if your truly a better organization wouldnt you aim for wins against teams of a higher caliber?

And how many playoff series have you won with the roster you have now?

 

[VC15]

Your so hyped bout those 2 wins vs us yet always talk about how mediocre we are i dont get it if your truly a better organization wouldnt you aim for wins against teams of a higher caliber?

And how many playoff series have you won with the roster you have now?

It just so happens that you're the only one here who keeps bringing up "12 wins" when 1/6 of the Nets wins came against the NYK. We beat the Spurs and Celtics last year as well. Silly Bricks fan.

 

[playmaker7]

Honestly though, who cares about a 12-70 team? They're not good, shutup about them. This thread isn't even about the Nets.

 

[RipCity32]

LOL at Twill not wanting Melo.
He instantly becomes the best player on that team by a landslide.
Besides if he went there you would love him as soon as the season started, then claim you loved him all along.

 

[VC15]

Honestly though, who cares about a 12-70 team? They're not good, shutup about them. This thread isn't even about the Nets.

I wish that I had a lack of integrity like you. Then I could hop on and off of bandwagons whenever I please without feeling guilty. The Nets are a front runner to get Carmelo Anthony through a trade. If you read the article I posted (you probably didn't) then you would know that. This thread is about Carmelo Anthony's impending move. Are you really this ignorant?

 

[DJT]

...wow.

The Nets obviously think they would be better with him, or else they wouldn't try to get him. I don't see how you don't want him to go to your team, the guy is one of the best players in the NBA, especially scoring wise.

And just cause a player demands to be traded somewhere doesn't mean crap. The team will ship him wherever they feel they get a decent deal out of it.

I wonder what NJ and LAC are offering for Melo.

 

[VC15]

...wow.

The Nets obviously think they would be better with him, or else they wouldn't try to get him. I don't see how you don't want him to go to your team, the guy is one of the best players in the NBA, especially scoring wise.

And just cause a player demands to be traded somewhere doesn't mean crap. The team will ship him wherever they feel they get a decent deal out of it.

I wonder what NJ and LAC are offering for Melo.

Scoring is about the only thing he does well. The the only thing we are missing at this point is a go to scorer. I understand that you have a special bias for Syracuse products, but Melo is not as great as advertised.

Carmelo Anthony Is Not An Elite Player


Point totals may make it seem like Melo can score at will. But his shot volume is off the charts.

Carmelo Anthony has averaged 20 points per game every season since he arrived in the NBA. This past campaign, he became the third-youngest player ever to reach the 10,000-point plateau, behind only Kobe Bryant and LeBron James. And next summer, he could hit the open market as an unrestricted free agent.

But despite all those gaudy point totals, the three-time All-Star may not even be worth the max deal a team would likely give him in 2011.

At first glance, Anthony seems like a member of the NBA's elite, largely due to his scoring prowess. But a deeper look at the points column and elsewhere in his game reveals a player who lives on an undeserved reputation more than his actual impact on wins.

It's tough to argue with his 28.2 points-per-game average in '09-10, but in the game of basketball, how a shooter gets his points is more meaningful than the raw number itself. To see that, we need to peel back the layers.

Let's first talk about Anthony's shot volume. It's not exactly a secret that 'Melo likes to shoot the rock, but his propensity to launch shots may raise some eyebrows. This past season, no player in the NBA took more shots per minute than Anthony -- not Kobe, not LeBron, not even scoring champ Kevin Durant.

It may seem obvious that a player worthy of 20 shots per game would have a healthy conversion rate. But in Anthony's case, that's far from the truth. Anthony, in reality, had a below-average field goal percentage (.458) this past season -- and his career percentage (.459) is no different. (The league average is .463.)

The sharp readers out there will point out that traditional field goal percentage doesn't reflect Anthony's shooting ability, since he launches a healthy dose of 3-pointers, which obviously count more on the scoreboard. That's true. But if you've been paying attention, you know Anthony is not a good shooter from beyond the arc, so that doesn't help his case. As a career .308 percent 3-point shooter, his shot from downtown ranks far below the norm (the average small forward shot .349 last season; Melo shot .316) and any progress he seemingly made in 2008-09, when he shot a career-high .371, disappeared. Even if we incorporate the added point bonus of a 3-pointer, the Syracuse product's shooting percentages are, at best, average.

It seems that, anyway we slice it, Anthony is a gunner at the core. His exceptional skill on offense is his ability to get his shot off, whether it's attacking the rim or through a patented pull-up jumper on the perimeter. But interestingly enough, Anthony got his shot blocked a whopping 109 times last season, which ranks as the second-highest total in the league, according to Hoopdata.com. Evidently, he doesn't lack perseverance.

Anthony's case illustrates a fundamental problem in conventional basketball analysis: scoring averages don't reflect efficiency. It's true that Anthony scored 28.2 points per game last season, but it's also true that no player missed more shots as often as Anthony did. Feel free to credit his skill but also pay attention his lofty shot volume and playing time.

And that's before we consider the disguise of team pace. Since Anthony entered the league, the Denver Nuggets have averaged 95.9 possessions per game, which places them as the third -fastest squad in the NBA over that period of time (and just a fraction behind the high-octane Phoenix Suns). Over that same span, the Nuggets have squeezed out an extra four possessions per game when compared to the average NBA team. Do the math, and the Nuggets have enjoyed nearly 2,000 extra possessions above the norm since Anthony joined the NBA. That's a ton of extra opportunities that can pad the per-game stats used as measuring sticks.

So after stripping out the inflationary effect of fast pace and boiling down Anthony's numbers to a per possession level, his scoring punch looks even more pedestrian. How pedestrian? Anthony's career offensive rating, an efficiency measure that calculates how many points a player produces per 100 possessions he uses, checks out at 107, which sits right at the league average. For reference, 2003 draft-mates James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh have earned 114, 111, and 113 lifetime offensive ratings, respectively.

Before we prematurely call Anthony an average player, there is something to be said for the burden of trust. Not every player can still perform while shouldering the heavy scoring responsibility that Anthony has endured. But the Nuggets have probably allowed Anthony to shoot far too often if efficiency -- and winning -- is their goal. In fact, last season Melo was only sixth on his own team in ORtg (110), trailing far behind other legit weapons like Nene (124), Chauncey Billups (120) and Ty Lawson (118).

Aside from scoring, Anthony doesn't have many other bankable weapons as a player. His rebounding (career 6.2 rpg) is only slightly better than what we'd expect from a small forward, and he doesn't create opportunities for his teammates like Paul Pierce, Wade and James can. Furthermore, he hasn't shown the intensity and dedication on the defensive end that you'd want from a max player.

In the end, Anthony's game demonstrates why it's important to strip away the biases that color our perceptions of elite players. In Anthony's case, the excessive shot volume, his team's stat-padding tempo and the lack of a true 3-point game makes his 28.2 ppg seem far less impressive than his sparkling reputation would suggest.

If anything, it's time we moved on from per-game statistics to evaluate our players. Millions of dollars are wasted every year basing player value on the archaic statistics that teams used half a century ago. And someone will surely overpay Anthony and offer him a max contract -- just look at the deals Joe Johnson and Rudy Gay got.

If the New York Knicks, rumored to be the favorites to land Melo if he decides to leave Denver, are expecting salvation from Anthony next summer, they're going to be very disappointed with their investment. It would be a much a wiser move to throw that cash toward the pursuit of Chris Paul, a real max player.

Tom Haberstroh is a frequent contributor to ESPN Insider

 

[DJT]

Wait so you just said Melo is only good at scoring and you guys need a go to scorer...makes sense to me.

 

[snipezo]

If melo gets traded to new jersey, DH would be all over his ass.

 

[dez]

It just so happens that you're the only one here who keeps bringing up "12 wins" when 1/6 of the Nets wins came against the NYK. We beat the Spurs and Celtics last year as well. Silly Bricks fan.

I bring up 12 wins cause your constantly talking down on other teams when yours was the worst of them all last season

Fact is JKidd isnt there anymore, KMart isnt there anymore you have a new front office. So its time to face the truth your not a winning team you keep saying you dont want this player dont want that player when its really a kop out to give your team an excuse to continue to suck.

But hey you wanna keep thinking Brook Lopez Devin Harris and Terrance Williams are enough to get you a OBrien trophy go right ahead...

 

[Big Bid'Ness]

Billups Might Be A Trade Chip As Well

John Hollinger of ESPN.com points out that the Nuggets could also shop point guard Chauncey Billups if Carmelo Anthony is indeed traded.

"Remember, if the Nuggets trade Melo and rebuild, there's really no point in them keeping Billups either. Could be two All-Stars on market," Hollinger wrote on his Twitter page.

Anthony told Denver this week that he wants to be dealt.

 

[$tunna]

Another reason why the NBA is becoming a joke.. Players have all the power, he can force his way to one team. Good thing there will be a lock out next season though.

Agreed. The power of the players these days is crazy lol

 

[Pugz]

lol. dh gets a semi hate article on melo. fact is, melo IS an elite player and in the top 10..

 

[VC15]

lol. dh gets a semi hate article on melo. fact is, melo IS an elite player and in the top 10..

Prove it then.

 

[bestkeptsecret13]

The Denver Nuggets are having serious discussions about a four-way trade that would land Carmelo Anthony with the New Jersey Nets, according to sources with knowledge of the negotiations.

The proposed deal, sources said, also would involve the Utah Jazz and the Charlotte Bobcats. It would deliver Nets rookie forward Derrick Favors, Jazz veteran Andrei Kirilenko and multiple first-round picks to Denver in exchange for their franchise player, potentially bringing a resolution to Anthony's uncertain future before the Nuggets hold their first practice of the new season.

Sources told ESPN.com that the deal, which has yet to be finalized, also would send former All-Star point guard Devin Harris to Charlotte, with Bobcats forward Boris Diaw moving to Utah.

The four teams, said one source close to the talks, are "seriously engaged" after extensive talks Thursday.

Charlotte and Utah make out great IMO. Denver doesn't do too bad getting Favors and draft picks, but I'm not really sure about the Nets gutting their team for Carmelo... Where are they going exactly? Melo couldn't lead a Nuggets team with a good supporting cast, what's he gonna do with Brook Lopez and a pile of garbage?

 

[DJT]

Yeah, I think that is the only thing that could hold up this deal. Favors + harris + picks for Anthony, that is really gonna hurt the Nets. But Diaw would fit perfectly in Utah's system, and Harris would be the PG that Charlotte needs.

 

[bestkeptsecret13]

Yeah, I think that is the only thing that could hold up this deal. Favors + harris + picks for Anthony, that is really gonna hurt the Nets. But Diaw would fit perfectly in Utah's system, and Harris would be the PG that Charlotte needs.

I think the deal is great for Charlotte and Utah. LOL

I can see the Bobcats including D.J. Augustin and sending him to the Nets though.

 

[DJT]

True if DJ is included, that would help the Nets out at PG.