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Going to put together a list of positive and negative moves made by Dumars in his career here as GM, as well as obvious moves that he had to make....
Positive Moves:
2000 - Traded Grant Hill for Ben Wallace and Chucky Atkins
Ben Wallace becomes the face of the franchise for years to come. Grant Hill never stayed healthy, though if he did this deal could have looked a lot different.
2002 - Drafted Tayshaun Prince 23rd overall
Good pick late in the draft, became the 5th best starter on a championship team.
2002- Signed Chauncey Billups
Chauncey leads the team to a title, becomes the franchise PG and Finals MVP.
2002 - Traded Jerry Stackhouse, Brian Cardinal, and Ratko Varda for Richard Hamilton and Hubert Davis
Traded Stackhouse just after his prime for a great young scorer in Hamilton.
2003 - Hired Larry Brown as coach
Led the team to the Finals twice in his 2 years here, including winning 1 of them.
2004 - Traded away Chucky Atkins, Lindsey Hunter, Bob Sura, and Zeljko Rebraca for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace
Easily his best move, as he traded hot garbage for the missing piece of a title team.
2004 - Signed Antonio McDyess
Most figured his career was done but helped the team get back to the Finals in 2005.
2006 - Traded Darko Milicic and Carlos Arroyo for Kelvin Cato and a 1st round pick
Dumars did a good job of getting value out of Milicic, in a 1st round pick.
2007 - Drafting Rodney Stuckey 15th overall, and Arron Afflalo 27th overall
Both picks were of good value for where they were taken. Stuckey is a solid rotational player, and Afflalo is playing at an all-star level.
2013 - Traded Austin Daye and Tayshaun Prince for Jose Calderon
Daye and Prince shouldn't have been on the roster (see later), but Dumars made a good deal for an expiring contract. That cap space he used however...(see later).
Obvious Moves:
2010 - Drafted Greg Monroe
Greg Monroe fell in his lap, In a re-draft he would probably go around 4 or 5. Keep in mind the Pistons would have likely drafted Ekpe Udoh if the Warriors didn't draft him the pick prior.
2012 - Drafted Andre Drummond
Could end up being the 2nd best player from this draft, yet fell all the way to 9. I give Dumars no credit for this as any GM with a brain would have made the selection. Would've been John Henson if not him, though also would have been a solid pick.
Negative Moves:
2000 - Drafted Mateen Cleaves 14th overall
Though this draft sucked, Cleaves was an awful player, and could have taken pretty much anyone else and gotten more production from that spot.
2001 - Drafted Rodney White 9th overall
Players taken shortly after White? Joe Johnson and Richard Jefferson. White played 1 season in Detroit.
2003 - Drafted Darko Milicic 2nd overall
No explanation needed.
2004 - Traded Cliff Robinson and Pepe Sanchez for Bob Sura
I don't know if this was some sort of salary saving deal, but he traded for Sura who at the time was averaging 14 a game. He went on to average 4 a game for the rest of the season in Detroit, meanwhile Cliff continued his 12 a game production in Golden State.
2004 - Traded Corliss Williamson for Derrick Coleman and Amal McCaskill
Corliss averaged about 10 a game the season prior to being traded. Coleman played 5 games for the team.
2005 - Firing Larry Brown
IIRC, Joe got mad that Brown was talking with other teams, and ended up just letting Brown go.
2005 - Hiring Flip Saunders as head coach
While Flip wasn't a bad coach, he did not co-exist well with Ben Wallace, which lead to.....
2006 - Not paying Ben Wallace
Let the face of the franchise go, and the team was never the same. He would try to cover it up by signing Nazr fucking Mohammed.
2008 - Firing Flip Saunders
Made sense at the time, until they replace him with......
2008 - Hiring Michael Curry as head coach
Dumars threw a 1st time head coach into a team of veterans, the rationale behind this was mind boggling to me. Curry never got control of the team.
2008 - The entire fucking draft.
In the draft, Dumars selected DJ White with our 29th overall pick. However he would trade that pick for the rights to Walter Sharpe (32nd overall) and Trent Plaisted (46th overall). At 29th overall he could have taken DeAndre Jordan, as we had a glaring need at center. OR he could have taken him with the 32nd overall pick that we traded for as well. He essentially had two chances to draft Jordan, and instead we got stuck with a player with fucking narcolepsy and a Mormon who never played in the league.
2008 - Signing Richard Hamilton to an extension
Richard probably wouldn't have signed the extension if he knew the next move was coming. You could tell he did not want to be here after that, and never fit in as well due to the next move. The Pistons were stuck paying his contract until last season..
2008 - Traded Chauncey Billups and Antonio McDyess for Allen Iverson
Most fans, myself included, were excited with the trade. We finally got the "superstar" we were looking for in AI. Obviously this whole trade was a fucking fail. Billups went on to have a MVP caliber season in Denver, while AI never meshed and ended up leaving the team after the all-star break. Eventually the Pistons were swept in the first round by LeBron. This deal also signified Dumars had a lot of faith in Stuckey, which comes in to play later.
But there was a silver lining of the deal, the Pistons had the expiring contract of Allen Iverson which helped them use their cap space to sign.......
2009 - Signed Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva
Added Ben Gordon to an already crowded backcourt and eventually had to correct this move by making an even worse move (see later). And Villanueva is probably one of the worst players in the NBA who is currently rotting on the Pistons bench.
2009 - Traded Amir Johnson for Fabrico Oberto
Amir is now a solid player for the Raptors, while Oberto never played a game for the Pistons.
2009 - Drafted Austin Daye 15th overall
As I said earlier, Dumars had too much faith in Stuckey. Players drafted after Daye that would have helped out more: Jrue Holiday, Ty Lawson, and Jeff Teague.
2009 - Traded Arron Afflalo and Walter Sharpe for a future 2nd round pick from Denver
Dumars essentially used this deal to create more CAP space to sign Chris Wilcox. Afflalo has became an all-star caliber player in Orlando, while that 2nd round pick from Denver turned into Vernon Macklin
2009 - Hired John Kuester as head coach
Another guy that failed with the team, awful coach.
2011 - Hired Lawrence Frank as head coach
See John Kuester.
2011 - Signing Tayshaun Prince to an extension
Prince's time here should have been done this off-season, but NAW, Dumars gave him an extension instead
2011 - Signing Rodney Stuckey to an extension
Again, too much faith in Stuckey, gave him too much money that he didn't deserve. Had the chance to buy him out this last off-season for a fraction of the cost, but opted to keep him instead. Luckily he is playing pretty well for once. Though it is a contract year, so I'm sure he will get another extension he didn't warrant.
2012 - Trading Ben Gordon and a 1st round pick for Corey Maggette
This wasn't an awful deal, if we had a competent GM. Figured by now we wouldn't have to worry about that pick, (top 8 protected in 2014), but no, the Pistons are still awful and are likely going to lose that pick while still missing the playoffs. But they did get rid of Gordon's awful contract (another Dumars blunder), BUT we used Maggette's expiring contract too...
2013 - Signed Josh Smith
Would have been a decent signing for not having Greg Monroe at the power forward. Now to fix yet another blunder, Dumars will have to trade Monroe in order to fit Smith on the roster. I will say, that this could move to positive moves if he can get good value for Monroe, and Smith starts playing up to that contract. But at this point, given the Dumars track record, unlikely.
2013 - Hired Mo Cheeks as head coach.
He could be the most awful coaches of all the hires by Dumars. He certainly has more talent on the team than Frank and Kuester had, yet the team looks just as worse.
Jury Is Still Out:
2013 - Traded Brandon Knight and Khris Middleton for Brandon Jennings
While I still like this deal, as Jennings is an upgrade over Knight, and his contract isn't all that bad. Knight has put together some impressive games in Milwaukee, and could potentially live to the potential he had when he was drafted. Also Khris Middleton will be a rotational player for years to come. So while I'll give Dumars the benefit of the doubt now for this deal, it could certainly turn into a negative move.
So please, someone explain to me how Joe Dumars still has his job in Detroit?
I count 10 positive moves to 24 negative moves. Including only 1 positive since 2007. Plus I think I was pretty nice with the McDyess move. So really only 9. And those 9 pretty much all led to a negative move.
Positive Moves:
2000 - Traded Grant Hill for Ben Wallace and Chucky Atkins
Ben Wallace becomes the face of the franchise for years to come. Grant Hill never stayed healthy, though if he did this deal could have looked a lot different.
2002 - Drafted Tayshaun Prince 23rd overall
Good pick late in the draft, became the 5th best starter on a championship team.
2002- Signed Chauncey Billups
Chauncey leads the team to a title, becomes the franchise PG and Finals MVP.
2002 - Traded Jerry Stackhouse, Brian Cardinal, and Ratko Varda for Richard Hamilton and Hubert Davis
Traded Stackhouse just after his prime for a great young scorer in Hamilton.
2003 - Hired Larry Brown as coach
Led the team to the Finals twice in his 2 years here, including winning 1 of them.
2004 - Traded away Chucky Atkins, Lindsey Hunter, Bob Sura, and Zeljko Rebraca for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace
Easily his best move, as he traded hot garbage for the missing piece of a title team.
2004 - Signed Antonio McDyess
Most figured his career was done but helped the team get back to the Finals in 2005.
2006 - Traded Darko Milicic and Carlos Arroyo for Kelvin Cato and a 1st round pick
Dumars did a good job of getting value out of Milicic, in a 1st round pick.
2007 - Drafting Rodney Stuckey 15th overall, and Arron Afflalo 27th overall
Both picks were of good value for where they were taken. Stuckey is a solid rotational player, and Afflalo is playing at an all-star level.
2013 - Traded Austin Daye and Tayshaun Prince for Jose Calderon
Daye and Prince shouldn't have been on the roster (see later), but Dumars made a good deal for an expiring contract. That cap space he used however...(see later).
Obvious Moves:
2010 - Drafted Greg Monroe
Greg Monroe fell in his lap, In a re-draft he would probably go around 4 or 5. Keep in mind the Pistons would have likely drafted Ekpe Udoh if the Warriors didn't draft him the pick prior.
2012 - Drafted Andre Drummond
Could end up being the 2nd best player from this draft, yet fell all the way to 9. I give Dumars no credit for this as any GM with a brain would have made the selection. Would've been John Henson if not him, though also would have been a solid pick.
Negative Moves:
2000 - Drafted Mateen Cleaves 14th overall
Though this draft sucked, Cleaves was an awful player, and could have taken pretty much anyone else and gotten more production from that spot.
2001 - Drafted Rodney White 9th overall
Players taken shortly after White? Joe Johnson and Richard Jefferson. White played 1 season in Detroit.
2003 - Drafted Darko Milicic 2nd overall
No explanation needed.
2004 - Traded Cliff Robinson and Pepe Sanchez for Bob Sura
I don't know if this was some sort of salary saving deal, but he traded for Sura who at the time was averaging 14 a game. He went on to average 4 a game for the rest of the season in Detroit, meanwhile Cliff continued his 12 a game production in Golden State.
2004 - Traded Corliss Williamson for Derrick Coleman and Amal McCaskill
Corliss averaged about 10 a game the season prior to being traded. Coleman played 5 games for the team.
2005 - Firing Larry Brown
IIRC, Joe got mad that Brown was talking with other teams, and ended up just letting Brown go.
2005 - Hiring Flip Saunders as head coach
While Flip wasn't a bad coach, he did not co-exist well with Ben Wallace, which lead to.....
2006 - Not paying Ben Wallace
Let the face of the franchise go, and the team was never the same. He would try to cover it up by signing Nazr fucking Mohammed.
2008 - Firing Flip Saunders
Made sense at the time, until they replace him with......
2008 - Hiring Michael Curry as head coach
Dumars threw a 1st time head coach into a team of veterans, the rationale behind this was mind boggling to me. Curry never got control of the team.
2008 - The entire fucking draft.
In the draft, Dumars selected DJ White with our 29th overall pick. However he would trade that pick for the rights to Walter Sharpe (32nd overall) and Trent Plaisted (46th overall). At 29th overall he could have taken DeAndre Jordan, as we had a glaring need at center. OR he could have taken him with the 32nd overall pick that we traded for as well. He essentially had two chances to draft Jordan, and instead we got stuck with a player with fucking narcolepsy and a Mormon who never played in the league.
2008 - Signing Richard Hamilton to an extension
Richard probably wouldn't have signed the extension if he knew the next move was coming. You could tell he did not want to be here after that, and never fit in as well due to the next move. The Pistons were stuck paying his contract until last season..
2008 - Traded Chauncey Billups and Antonio McDyess for Allen Iverson
Most fans, myself included, were excited with the trade. We finally got the "superstar" we were looking for in AI. Obviously this whole trade was a fucking fail. Billups went on to have a MVP caliber season in Denver, while AI never meshed and ended up leaving the team after the all-star break. Eventually the Pistons were swept in the first round by LeBron. This deal also signified Dumars had a lot of faith in Stuckey, which comes in to play later.
But there was a silver lining of the deal, the Pistons had the expiring contract of Allen Iverson which helped them use their cap space to sign.......
2009 - Signed Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva
Added Ben Gordon to an already crowded backcourt and eventually had to correct this move by making an even worse move (see later). And Villanueva is probably one of the worst players in the NBA who is currently rotting on the Pistons bench.
2009 - Traded Amir Johnson for Fabrico Oberto
Amir is now a solid player for the Raptors, while Oberto never played a game for the Pistons.
2009 - Drafted Austin Daye 15th overall
As I said earlier, Dumars had too much faith in Stuckey. Players drafted after Daye that would have helped out more: Jrue Holiday, Ty Lawson, and Jeff Teague.
2009 - Traded Arron Afflalo and Walter Sharpe for a future 2nd round pick from Denver
Dumars essentially used this deal to create more CAP space to sign Chris Wilcox. Afflalo has became an all-star caliber player in Orlando, while that 2nd round pick from Denver turned into Vernon Macklin
2009 - Hired John Kuester as head coach
Another guy that failed with the team, awful coach.
2011 - Hired Lawrence Frank as head coach
See John Kuester.
2011 - Signing Tayshaun Prince to an extension
Prince's time here should have been done this off-season, but NAW, Dumars gave him an extension instead
2011 - Signing Rodney Stuckey to an extension
Again, too much faith in Stuckey, gave him too much money that he didn't deserve. Had the chance to buy him out this last off-season for a fraction of the cost, but opted to keep him instead. Luckily he is playing pretty well for once. Though it is a contract year, so I'm sure he will get another extension he didn't warrant.
2012 - Trading Ben Gordon and a 1st round pick for Corey Maggette
This wasn't an awful deal, if we had a competent GM. Figured by now we wouldn't have to worry about that pick, (top 8 protected in 2014), but no, the Pistons are still awful and are likely going to lose that pick while still missing the playoffs. But they did get rid of Gordon's awful contract (another Dumars blunder), BUT we used Maggette's expiring contract too...
2013 - Signed Josh Smith
Would have been a decent signing for not having Greg Monroe at the power forward. Now to fix yet another blunder, Dumars will have to trade Monroe in order to fit Smith on the roster. I will say, that this could move to positive moves if he can get good value for Monroe, and Smith starts playing up to that contract. But at this point, given the Dumars track record, unlikely.
2013 - Hired Mo Cheeks as head coach.
He could be the most awful coaches of all the hires by Dumars. He certainly has more talent on the team than Frank and Kuester had, yet the team looks just as worse.
Jury Is Still Out:
2013 - Traded Brandon Knight and Khris Middleton for Brandon Jennings
While I still like this deal, as Jennings is an upgrade over Knight, and his contract isn't all that bad. Knight has put together some impressive games in Milwaukee, and could potentially live to the potential he had when he was drafted. Also Khris Middleton will be a rotational player for years to come. So while I'll give Dumars the benefit of the doubt now for this deal, it could certainly turn into a negative move.
So please, someone explain to me how Joe Dumars still has his job in Detroit?
I count 10 positive moves to 24 negative moves. Including only 1 positive since 2007. Plus I think I was pretty nice with the McDyess move. So really only 9. And those 9 pretty much all led to a negative move.
